Doo Dah 2009

[mrsenortyler]

I think the OB string along 6 was a good thing. The biggest reason is for safety, I don't think we wanted people trying to climb down and take a shot standing on a slope of rocks.

It would be very simple to say if you throw over the edge of the river bank bring your disc to the top stroke free. Not a concern to me, my disc was well into the river.

This seems to me like it would be rewarding bad shots. Put the disc in play and don't worry about it.

The OB on 16 made was a little crazy. If you are in the creek or water you are OB that is simple. Here is the problem that came up on my card: Two in the tall grass and one on the Sidewalk.

I somewhat agree with this statement. The hole already plays pretty tough. The string did however get rid of *most* gray areas as far as "Is this in or out?" and probably saved some headaches for Randy.

[smitty]

The string was good. If you look at it as a safety issue. I am sure that nobody crawled down the bank to look for or grab a disc. 9 out of 10 times if you hit that bank you are gone.

I did go OB into the tall grass on hole 16. I even saw the string. Just threw a horrible shot and got double punished for it. What is the answer to the left side of the sidewalk? There is a ton of land on the left. I guarantee people played safe from that short grass.

I am in no way blaming the string or new OB for my bad play the last round. All the blame for that falls straight on my shoulders. I knew what was going on, I just didn't execute my shots.

[Schoen-hopper]

There is no OB sidewalk on hole 16.

[DUH]

The sidewalks that were OB were listed in the OB section on the map. 16's sidewalk was not listed so it's not OB. The short grass is safe; the OB was clearly marked. I know it seemed to be a bit much, but Chris is right, we were trying to save on some debates. There is not a defined water line on that stream and grass grows throughout; it would be a hard call to say if a lie is surrounded by water or not. Plus, discs are hard to find in that tall grass so we were trying to save some search time.

Safety was the issue with the line along the river. Usually, the river is up higher, so if you're not on top, you're OB anyway.

One last thing, Hole 6.
Why not make the last tree in the fairway a mando also?

You must be joking. The purpose of the mandos on 6 & 7 is to keep players from driving into the other hole's fairway. I have enough trouble staying out of the river on that hole; we don't need anymore mandos there.

[smitty]

Well the string added to the confusion on hole 16. Hole 16 needs to addressed more on the course map. When tourneys can be won or lost by a stroke or two it should be clear. Something as simple as an unclear hole could cause a person to not come back in the future. Josh Crowl landed on the sidewalk and played it both as safe and OB. He ended up with the same score both ways, so the issue was never brought to the attention of tourney HQ.

Not joking on hole 6. The long tee is even or beyond the last tree in 6's fairway. A person could throw a perfect drive down the fairway then throw directly at the long tee for hole 7. As far as keeping a disc out of the water, plan your shot and execute it. Lay-up to the tree and then go for the pin. A huge gun like Coda bombed a drive beyond the last mando and into 7's fairway. I don't want to get nailed by a d


Not trying to start a huge debate. Just stating what I see in hopes to making the tourney better in the future.

[mrsenortyler]

Not trying to start a huge debate.

Doesn't sound like it.

As for the Sidewalk on 16, if there was OB marked on the hole, and the sidewalk wasn't marked, it would seem to me that the sidewalk would not be OB. Plus, was there any other unmarked OB on the sheets provided? Not that hard to figure out. You did the right thing in playing the provisional.

Extra Mando on hole 6, i don't think it sounds like a bad idea... the tree by the short pin I think? I know I threw a hyzer to the basket as soon as I could. Being forced to go straight, turnover or side arm, (RH) could really make the hole play a little more difficult to where good shots were rewarded. Probably would also increase the # of discs thrown in on the hole as well though.

[smitty]

Not trying to start a huge debate.

Doesn't sound like it.

As for the Sidewalk on 16, if there was OB marked on the hole, and the sidewalk wasn't marked, it would seem to me that the sidewalk would not be OB. Plus, was there any other unmarked OB on the sheets provided? Not that hard to figure out. You did the right thing in playing the provisional.

The OB string on the hole was connected to both sides of the bridge. Making it appear that only the right side of the sidewalk was safe. There are unmarked OB sidewalks all over the course. Holes 2, 3, 4, 5, 7 all have sidewalks on the side of the fairway. You are OB if you cross the sidewalk and are in the grass between the sidewalk and hole. Hole 12 is another example. There is a blue mark on the sidewalk that I have no clue what it means.


Am I stirring the pot? Yes. Am I doing it because the tourney was a huge failure? No. One of the best things that could be done would make a simple rules sheet hole by hole.

Hole 16
-OB River and Street
-OB in roped off area around creek
-SW and over are SAFE on this hole



The extra mando on hole 6 may be to much. I mean there are already 2 mandos on the hole. More Mandos more problems.

EX.

Hole 5 long tee. You hit a tree kick to the right, but make the first mando. So you throw a hyzer over Pawnee to the pin. Is this legal? Yes it was, I asked Randy. Why should it be legal? A mando is a mando.


Once again, GREAT JOB ACDGC. Take everything I am posting with a grain of salt.

[ditziwt]

Hole 12 is another example. There is a blue mark on the sidewalk that I have no clue what it means.

12 was very confusing... as there was no flags so we didnt know which sections of sidewalks were ok. both tee pads played a little different so it couldnt have been the same two sections, or were they the same ones? was the shore of the both ponds ok or just where the sidewalk sections are?

that is the hole that could have used the string the most.

[Schoen-hopper]

If you read the map, you would find that it was much more concise than doing a hole by hole list of OB's. That could take pages. If you had any question, the map could explain it.

Sidewalk around the WATER Center was basically for holes 9 & 10 (and 12).

I think the sidewalk & across should be OB for holes 1 & 2. That would be simpler, espescially with how those poles meet up with the sidewalk. There used to be a chain fence all the way down 18 & 1, but now it is partially gone on 18 and fully gone on 1.

Hole 12 was simple. Sidewalk and across was OB, except the two legs that you MUST cross. These connected before and after the bridge. There was a paint line, and there WERE flags for good measure. I did have an idea on hole 12 though. Why not make all the sidewalk and area between the 2 legs OB? That would give the hole more character and there would be some serious risk involved. It would be very punishing though. Something that could counter that would be to make a permanent drop zone tee at the top of the hill that would leave a 50' downhill putt for the short pin and a 120' shot to the long pin. It would be hard to change it now though.

On hole 5, I agree, it would be simpler to leave both mando's in effect. It would just be crazy punishing on those windy days when you get a crazy kick. I like those kind of holes though.

On holes 6 & 7, I'd prefer it if there were NO mando's. The holes are hard enough. Can you imagine playing 6 long with a strong NORTH wind? But, there is legitimacy to the safety arguement. I've been trying to plant trees there for years to seperate the fairways better. We finally got some hedge trees planted, but they look like they will take a few years to get going. And they can't be planted closer than 25' apart. If you plant another one, it will be in one fairway or another. These fairways are just too narrow. Blame the road construction. That's the reason I don't think planting trees down by the river would be a good idea. Instead of "saving" shots from the water, they would punish good shots and force players up into 7's fairway.

Hole 10 has 2 mando trees. One is absolutely rediculously retarded. You only need the one on the left. Making the one on the right mando just makes it confusing and doesn't serve any purpose. But every time I bring this up, I get some cranky reply from the Be Oh Be.

I used to think the mando on 4 was extremely stupid. And it was for many years. Until we made a long pin to the right on that hole. Now it makes sense.

The city has disallowed us to paint the mando trees any more. I'm not sure if they will let us do anything else either. The design wouldn't be a problem if the park hadn't shrunk 3 times. As it is, the course needs the mando's to help curb the safety problem.

[mrsenortyler]

Am I stirring the pot? Yes. Am I doing it because the tourney was a huge failure? No.

Would you be stirring the pot (on the forum) if this tournament was run by me, or Rusco? No. You would take your complaints directly to us. Are you just hating on Wichita? Pretty much.



*edit*

The OB string on the hole was connected to both sides of the bridge. Making it appear that only the right side of the sidewalk was safe. There are unmarked OB sidewalks all over the course. Holes 2, 3, 4, 5, 7 all have sidewalks on the side of the fairway. You are OB if you cross the sidewalk and are in the grass between the sidewalk and hole.
.

If the rules sheet says, OB is "on and across the sidewalk on holes, #3, 4, 5, 6 and 7." I would think that would mean that on sidewalk and across on holes 1, 2, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 16, and 18 must be safe.

The rules does have OB hole by hole, you just have to read it.

[smitty]

I don't talk to anyone from Wichita like I do you and Rusco.

I have had many discussions with Rusco on Glass Blown Open topics.
-Hole by Hole OB
-Caddy Book
-Good Rope OB hole 16
-Poor Rope OB hole 2
-Course layout for rounds
-Ideas for next year

I probably talk to him 4 or 5 times a week. He always wants feedback.

You have ran 1 tourney. I voiced ideas and concerns about it to you.
-Pay park fees
-Not do an Island
-Drop Zone


I am not hating on Wichita at all. I love both courses. Doo Dah is one of the top tourneys in Kansas. I just know that it can grow and get bigger.

[Baconius]

I think there is a crap load of OB at Herman Hill. Combined with the wind on Saturday, it made for a very difficult day. But Smitty's right, it was all marked, we knew what was fair and what was not. I think all the string and very concise notations on the player maps made it easy to figure out, even for us that were playing it for the first time.
I just hope I can get a score under a billion strokes on it next year.


Great job all the way around!

[Schoen-hopper]

Anyone hear of someone with an OB free weekend?

[Schoen-hopper]

Injured list:

DM4 got hurt right before the tourney and couldn't play. We missed ya Don. I'll hold on to that T-rex.

Nick Bunch got some serious inflamation in his throwing arm and HAD to quit.

Hope you guys can recover and get back to chucking plastic soon.

[_dm4]

Injured list:

DM4 got hurt right before the tourney and couldn't play. We missed ya Don. I'll hold on to that T-rex.

Went to the doctor yesterday and it's not any kind of a tear, so that's good news. He said it was probably some kind of strain. Pain is a lot better than it was Sat. morning. Who would have thought that I shouldn't try the "butterfly" anymore??? Am getting old! Thanks for holding the T-Rex, Mike!